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Cutting out the middleman (a place where writers and students post their ads)?


brokenstepford 1 | 1  
Aug 10, 2010 | #1
Anyone know of a good forum that cuts out the middleman, so to speak? I'd like a place where writers and students post their own ads, so that prospective applicants or clients can judge for themselves based on the spelling and grammar in the post. Every site I've looked at so far charges a cut from 10-50%, and I'd rather not bother with that.

Or is Craigslist my only shot?
ssoommee - | 5  
Aug 24, 2010 | #2
i dont think there are such things.. hahaha
pooch - | 1  
Aug 27, 2010 | #3
brokenstepford - I was wondering exactly that, particularly as there seems to be a deficit of good essay writers for humanities subjects in these companies (namely the arts, literature, possibly history too). I've just graduated in Lit & Hist and want to work as an essay writer full-time this year before doing my MA.

The other option is to work for a number of companies, so I'm planning on signing up to around 4 legitimate ones.

Craigslist crossed my mind too; I may offer my services there instead.

Edit: the work produced by some of these so-called graduates/professional writers is appalling. I'd much rather pay an intelligent individual who'd do a decent job - undergraduate, graduate or otherwise.
PeriodWriter - | 2  
Aug 27, 2010 | #4
Im actually in the same boat pooch. I've been doing freelance for a couple of years. Was a Psych/English major. If you don't mind, PM me and let me know if you find a good company. I just started to work over the internet recently. I used to work at the local college but since I left work has slowed down.

In response to your question broken, I've looked for a while and not found a website or forum that offers that service. I would recommend going through craigslist. Find an individual who uses paypal and will work with you to fulfill your requirements. You will probably pay 17-25 per page for quality service.
WritersBeware  
Aug 27, 2010 | #5
I would recommend going through craigslist.

Craigslist is a haven for fraud. It is arguably the absolute WORST source through which anyone can find and pay a writer.

ZERO ACCOUNTABILITY
ZERO INFORMATION SECURITY
ZERO LEGAL RECOURSE
ZERO PAYPAL PROTECTION
ZERO REGULATION
ZERO RELIABILITY
ZERO SAFETY
ZERO VALIDATION OF SKILLS/EXPERIENCE
FreelanceWriter    5 | 1,297 ☆☆☆☆   Freelance Writer
Aug 27, 2010 | #6
I've advertised on Craigslist and have found several long-term clients from there. I've also used it to find a carpenter/home improvement handyman and the very first one whose ad I responded to has worked out great. My clients have used PayPal and I paid the carpenter after the work in cash. You can minimize your risk by selecting someone local to you and documenting all your conversations in email. That way, if things go bad, you always have the option of small claims court. If they're too far away, it's just not worth the expense of travel to recover a few hundred dollars or whatever. As always, (whether an Internet essay company, a freelance writer, or a carpenter), you should always start with a very small job as a test of legitimacy and honesty. Most rip-off artists only do rip offs;they don't usually provide a fantastic piece of test work and then cheat you on a bigger job.
WritersBeware  
Aug 27, 2010 | #7
I've advertised on Craigslist and have found several long-term clients from there.

There are exceptions to nearly every rule. For every one of you, there are probably thousands of potential fraudsters and unqualified "writers" in search of a quick, easy buck. To fool potential clients into believing that they are "local," they pay phone number forwarding services about $5.00/month and then pay over the phone for a UPS Store box in any one of hundreds of locations across the US. I hate to publicize these dirty secrets, but sometimes I have no choice.
stu4 24 | 893 ☆☆   Observer
Aug 27, 2010 | #8
FreelanceWriter is a living proof that working for the companies he's currently working (he's mentioned its name on numerous occasions here) is just a waste of time. All his efforts are focused on finding individual clients because otherwise he'd starve to death.

Just food for thought.
FreelanceWriter    5 | 1,297 ☆☆☆☆   Freelance Writer
Aug 27, 2010 | #9
There are exceptions to nearly every rule. For every one of you, there are probably thousands of potential fraudsters and unqualified "writers" in search of a quick, easy buck. To fool potential clients into believing that they are "local," they pay phone number forwarding services about $5.00/month and then pay over the phone for a UPS Store box in any one of hundreds of locations across the US. I hate to publicize these dirty secrets, but sometimes I have no choice.

Publicize away; it only harms the frauds and it helps out customers and those of us writers who aren't rip offs. I've had clients just hire me on faith but I've also had clients first check that my phone # and street address matched up and one even GoogleEarthed my building in addition to checking my ebay reputation and my other email addy that was linked to my PayPal account. He ordered 1 or 2 short essays before giving me his 30-pg dissertation.

I'm just suggesting that if clients are smart about it, they can really reduce (if not eliminate entirely) the risk of getting scammed on Craigslist. When I hired the carpenter, I did the same thing: I googled his name and his business name and his license # and I hired him for a small job before trusting him with anything more substantial.

FreelanceWriter is a living proof that working for the companies he's currently working (he's mentioned its name on numerous occasions here) is just a waste of time. All his efforts are focused on finding individual clients because otherwise he'd starve to death.

You're an idiot. Obviously, we earn more for less writing when an essay company doesn't take a fair cut for their role. It varies for me based on time of year, but my freelance work used to be just a small supplement to my company income. After doing this a while, a few satisfied customers led to enough referrals that I have more regular freelance work than I ever thought would be possible. It isn't even necessarily about earning more than I could just writing for the companies (although I definitely have been lately); it's more about having to do less writing for the same income.
stu4 24 | 893 ☆☆   Observer
Aug 27, 2010 | #10
So now that you have enough private customers writing for the company would be sheer idiocy on your part. You know that and you prefer to spend time spamming forums and the Internet to get more private clients instead writing for the company for less money.

Here even WritersBeware fully agrees with me, don't you?
PeriodWriter - | 2  
Aug 27, 2010 | #11
ZERO ACCOUNTABILITY
ZERO INFORMATION SECURITY
ZERO LEGAL RECOURSE
ZERO PAYPAL PROTECTION
ZERO REGULATION
ZERO RELIABILITY
ZERO SAFETY
ZERO VALIDATION OF SKILLS/EXPERIENCE

These are true of craigslist. However, using paypal provides much of this. The only information at risk is ones email adress. Paypal has a contesting system and, because of the assumed emails that will be sent back and forth outlaying the agreement, an individual should be able to prove if they are scamed.

As far as validation of skills go...well its the internet. Forgive the childish example: If I open up a website that says I am the King of Norway and vacation on Mars...this doesn't offer any validation. With essay writing references are unlikely.

All other forms of "safety" are really up to the wisdom of the user. A craigslist scammer is no different than any other online scammer.
WritersBeware  
Aug 27, 2010 | #12
A craigslist scammer is no different than any other online scammer.

That is simply not true. Granted, a Web site owner can also perpetrate scams, but not nearly as freely. A craigslist scammer has no online reputation to uphold, no Web hosting or domain registrar accounts to be potentially closed, no Web site rankings to risk, no investments to lose, and-by simply using anonymous proxies, fake names, and rotating/anonymous email addresses-virtually no concern for legal ramifications resulting fron any fraud that he/she plans to undertake.

I'm sure that you're aware of Philip Markoff, the "Craig's List Killer." S?-t happens. Yes, that's an extreme example.
FreelanceWriter    5 | 1,297 ☆☆☆☆   Freelance Writer
Aug 27, 2010 | #13
So now that you have enough private customers writing for the company would be sheer idiocy on your part. You know that and you prefer to spend time spamming forums and the Internet to get more private clients instead writing for the company for less money.

Obviously, I make less money on company papers. On the other hand, they've been a very consistent and reliable source of income for me for almost 7 years and I know they're not going anywhere. Freelance clients come and go and just because I have enough right now doesn't necessarily mean that I'll be able to replace all of them as they graduate. I can't count on them being around month after month, year after year. Even when most of my income comes from private clients, I still consider the company to be my "bread and butter" and my private work to be "supplementary" income.
WritersBeware  
Aug 27, 2010 | #14
So now that you have enough private customers writing for the company would be sheer idiocy on your part. You know that and you prefer to spend time spamming forums and the Internet to get more private clients instead writing for the company for less money.

Here even WritersBeware fully agrees with me, don't you?

You're a translucent moron, Yuri. You're not going to convince freelancewriter to stop working for what you have made painfully obvious is your most feared competitor. Sorry. You'll just have to be satisfied with the most incompetent writers in the industry. Hell, you misrepresent their talents and depend almost entirely on first-time customers (which is why you advertise "25% off first-time orders" on all of your sites), anyway, so what does it matter?

Do you really think that I am not 100% aware of your modus operandi on every conceivable level?
stu4 24 | 893 ☆☆   Observer
Aug 27, 2010 | #15
I still consider the company to be my "bread and butter" and my private work to be "supplementary" income.

You lie, previously you said you mostly work for private clients.

You are the least ethical contract writer I know, shame on you. You don't care about the company at all; if you had a chance you would drop them completely to get a quick buck. You easily forget without the company you would achieve nothing. I'm surprised WB is still putting up with you.

You are in DIRECT competition with the company that contracted you and you have the cheek to advertise here in front of your boss and the whole industry.

You're not going to convince freelancewriter to stop working for what you have made painfully obvious is your most feared competitor.

You know he would sell his mother if he got a good offer, so I'm not worried at all.
WritersBeware  
Aug 27, 2010 | #16
You are in DIRECT competition with the company that contracted you and you have the cheek to advertise here in front of your boss and the whole industry.

A freelance writer is under no obligation to not work for other companies or take private jobs, unless specifically limited in a written contract. Things work a tad differently here in the US, Yuri.
stu4 24 | 893 ☆☆   Observer
Aug 27, 2010 | #17
A freelance writer is under no obligation to not work for other companies or take private jobs, unless specifically limited in a written contract.

I perfectly know that, that's the industry standard.

But what he's doing here is SOLICITING his business in front of the company. It's like if you had a kiosk selling newspapers. You invested your money in the kiosk, hired a sales person, bought a delivery truck, do advertising. But every day a guy who is selling THE SAME newspapers shows up on his bike, stands in front of your kiosk and sells the same products for less money. That's exactly what FreelanceWriter is doing here.

If you fine with that don't post SPAM when others try to do the same, k?
FreelanceWriter    5 | 1,297 ☆☆☆☆   Freelance Writer
Aug 27, 2010 | #18
Just for the record, this was originally a thread about freelance writers working independent of essay companies. Nobody was promoting anything or criticizing anybody until you decided to contribute your wisdom to the discussion.

(1) You lie, previously you said you mostly work for private clients.

(2) You are the least ethical contract writer I know, shame on you. You don't care about the company at all; if you had a chance you would drop them completely to get a quick buck. You easily forget without the company you would achieve nothing. I'm surprised WB is still putting up with you.

(3) You are in DIRECT competition with the company that contracted you and you have the cheek to advertise here in front of your boss and the whole industry.

1. Most of my income comes from private clients right now. I still consider the company more stable in the long term and I appreciate my relationship with them very much. I have reason to believe the appreciation is mutual.

2. I already left them on good terms to work full-time for the government for a few years and they reinstated my account immediately when I let them know I was available again, no questions asked. They'd probably not be too upset if I chose to go 100% private and I'm sure they'd let me do as much work as I could for them anytime.

3. No kidding, Sherlock. They know we're competitors just like Pheelyks and I know we're freelance competitors. The companies (obviously) monitor these types of sites to keep track of anybody who defames their business and if there were any conflict about their writers also freelancing, we wouldn't have chosen to use our company IDs as our screen names here, Genius. The companies I write for know that I've referred some work from my freelance customers to them (including some from here). In fact, I make sure to let them know anytime one of my private clients needs work from them because if it ever became apparent in the future that we were sharing the same client, I want to be 100% sure they know the client used me first.

They also know that I compete fairly and that anytime a company client has approached me here or elsewhere, I've declined the offer and explained that I don't poach any of their clients. Every potential client who has not already used their services is fair game. Same goes for my relationship with Pheelyks: we've traded work in our respective areas for our established clients and we've referred brand new clients to one another as well.

(4) I perfectly know that, that's the industry standard.
(5) But what he's doing here is SOLICITING his business in front of the company. It's like if you had a kiosk selling newspapers. You invested your money in the kiosk, hired a sales person, bought a delivery truck, do advertising. But every day a guy who is selling THE SAME newspapers shows up on his bike, stands in front of your kiosk and sells the same products for less money. That's exactly what FreelanceWriter is doing here.

4. This has nothing to do with any "standard" in any "industry": Contractual obligations are formed by laws and by contracts. There's no such thing as any non-compete obligation or restriction by default in any "industry" unless it's specified in some contract agreed to by the parties. I'm guessing they probably figured out I freelanced as much as possible by the User ID that I selected for their websites and for this forum.

5. Horrible analogy. It's more like a wedding-band singer whose contract says "You get $___ for every gig you book with us and you're not allowed to steal any of our customers" also working as a freelance vocalist for anybody who needs a singer who isn't already a customer of the band or promoter. If all parties involved also frequented some of the same Internet forums and the singer very openly disclosed exactly who she was, nobody but an idiot would think there could possibly be anything "unethical" about that.
Extremely experienced, honest, versatile American writer in NYC with a Law Degree from NYLS: Visit NYCFreelanceWriter "dot" com
WritersBeware  
Aug 27, 2010 | #19
You know he would sell his mother if he got a good offer, so I'm not worried at all.

Yeah, Yuri went there . . . .
dnm - | 14  
Sep 27, 2010 | #20
stu4 thinks that writers who take on private clients are disloyal to the companies they work with? how? most companies know that we're not exclusive.
angrybird - | 4  
Oct 13, 2010 | #21
i think the other way to do it is to create a personal website and advertise yourself online.
post your website url in some local forums or classified post web etc... it will take time to build your customer base but i think it is a workable solution.
pheelyks  
Oct 14, 2010 | #22
Just stumbled on this thread after angrybird's revival, and while agreeing wholeheartedly with FW I would like to add that the difference in pay between direct-to-client and company work is often offset by the administrative hassle of being the only point person for customers. That is, the companies I work for pay me less than I earn from private customers, taking their cut as a middle man, because they have to deal with taking and processing orders and payments, maintaining records of who is owed what and when things re do, answering a lot of questions before (and sometimes after) orders are placed, etc. This is time consuming and is not something I get paid for (at least, not directly) when I work with customers one-on-one.

The fact is, seven or eight months out of the year there is more work available--through both companies and private clients--than I could ever possibly handle. This is why FW and I are fine sharing clients with each other, and (probably) why the companies we work for don't really care that we work privately, as long as we aren't poaching or using their site as a way to build our own private clientele base.

Good writers don't need to get desperate or "sell their mothers" to make a living at this...wonder what that says about stu4?
stu4 24 | 893 ☆☆   Observer
Oct 14, 2010 | #23
Good writers don't need to get desperate or "sell their mothers"

I never claimed FW is a 'good writer". Just the opposite - his writing style is very boring and unengaging, I would not even commission him to write a leaflet to advertise a local lawn mowing service.
pheelyks  
Oct 14, 2010 | #24
stu4, you wouldn't know a good writer if one smacked you across the face with an OED....something that sounds very tempting.
wlf1191 1 | 14  
Oct 14, 2010 | #25
stu4,

I would like to hire you to write a 50 page essay on the art of sucking wang. It sounds like you would have a great handle on this! I am sure WB could give you tips on the stroking balls chapter.
stu4 24 | 893 ☆☆   Observer
Oct 14, 2010 | #26
Sorry, I don't engage in conversations with morons who cannot produce a coherent essay in their native language.
pheelyks  
Oct 14, 2010 | #27
Sorry, I don't engage in conversations

He wasn't asking for a conversation, and according to his assumptions your mouth would be full, anyway.
WritersBeware  
Oct 14, 2010 | #28
I am sure WB could give you tips on the stroking balls chapter.

How is your filthy w*0re of a c*ck-gobbling mother doing these days?

Yeah, that's the only level of commentary that you deserve.
Smiley73 3 | 353 ☆☆  
Oct 30, 2017 | #29
Getting back on track. These days, the independent writers cut out the middlemen at Upwork or other similar independent worker bidding sites. It gives them a semblance of credibility. Others though, specially those who prefer to hide their country of origin and actual writing skills, ride the social media bandwagon in the hopes of scamming students. Twitter and Facebook are flooded with these sorts of independent writers who may or may not be on the level. You don't have to pay a cut to the social media site on your earnings. However, these sites prefer that you pay for advertising or priority level features so that your independent writer profile gets top billing on their sites. While the cost may be kind of steep for some writers, my friends tell me that this method of self advertisement actually works well because of the discussion exchange and personal that the social networks allow them to have with clients. The clients get to know their writing abilities and can verify that they are ENL writers and not an ESL writer trying to cover his tracks.



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